Comments on: Silly Women http://pattricejones.info/blog/archives/27 communications from an eco-anarcha-feminist animal Fri, 10 Sep 2010 04:07:10 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.1 By: pattrice http://pattricejones.info/blog/archives/27#comment-99 pattrice Fri, 08 Jun 2007 19:24:23 +0000 http://pattricejones.info/blog/archives/27#comment-99 Yes, and whether we are dealing with women or men, we must maintain our empathy with the suppressed feelings of those who are seeking to suppress feelings. That means finding ways to challenge their lack of empathy, and to insist that they be more responsible with their power, within an ethos of care for everybody. "I statements" that focus on behavior are a great way to do that: "I notice that you interrupt women whenever they start to talk about feelings." "I feel uncomfortable that we aren't taking better care of each other while doing this difficult work." "I felt disrespected when you said, '...'" And, my personal favorite, which I learned from friends who do domestic violence work, "It's not okay with me when you..." Yes, and whether we are dealing with women or men, we must maintain our empathy with the suppressed feelings of those who are seeking to suppress feelings. That means finding ways to challenge their lack of empathy, and to insist that they be more responsible with their power, within an ethos of care for everybody. “I statements” that focus on behavior are a great way to do that: “I notice that you interrupt women whenever they start to talk about feelings.” “I feel uncomfortable that we aren’t taking better care of each other while doing this difficult work.” “I felt disrespected when you said, ‘…’” And, my personal favorite, which I learned from friends who do domestic violence work, “It’s not okay with me when you…”

]]> By: Gary http://pattricejones.info/blog/archives/27#comment-93 Gary Fri, 08 Jun 2007 04:58:29 +0000 http://pattricejones.info/blog/archives/27#comment-93 >>>All of which is to say that men in positions of power, especially but not only in the animal advocacy movements, ought to think very carefully about the biases that might be at work when they suggest that women are being irrelevant or divisive by talking about feelings.>>> These thoughts aren't fully formed but let me lay them out there...I wonder, and I have some suspicion, that men sometimes do this because they are uncomfortable with their own feelings. By putting down feelings and devaluing the role of feelings in determining our relationships with and obligations to animals, they can superficially supress their feelings and avoid confronting them and talking about feelings, and retreat to the more antiseptic, academic, theoretical paradigms that they find more comfortable, less threatening. Unfortunately, in belittling feelings, they disrespect the women (and men) for whom feelings are an important part of their lives and worldviews, and sustain a male-dominated, two-tier system. The difficult and pressing challenge, for me anyway, is to channel these observations out of the purely academic and into critical self-review - have I, do I engage in the transgressions that I have identified (it's so much easier to spot flaws in others than in ourselves) - and consequent, positive personal change; IOW apply the lesson to myself. >>>All of which is to say that men in positions of power, especially but not only in the animal advocacy movements, ought to think very carefully about the biases that might be at work when they suggest that women are being irrelevant or divisive by talking about feelings.>>>

These thoughts aren’t fully formed but let me lay them out there…I wonder, and I have some suspicion, that men sometimes do this because they are uncomfortable with their own feelings. By putting down feelings and devaluing the role of feelings in determining our relationships with and obligations to animals, they can superficially supress their feelings and avoid confronting them and talking about feelings, and retreat to the more antiseptic, academic, theoretical paradigms that they find more comfortable, less threatening. Unfortunately, in belittling feelings, they disrespect the women (and men) for whom feelings are an important part of their lives and worldviews, and sustain a male-dominated, two-tier system.

The difficult and pressing challenge, for me anyway, is to channel these observations out of the purely academic and into critical self-review - have I, do I engage in the transgressions that I have identified (it’s so much easier to spot flaws in others than in ourselves) - and consequent, positive personal change; IOW apply the lesson to myself.

]]> By: Neva http://pattricejones.info/blog/archives/27#comment-83 Neva Thu, 07 Jun 2007 00:48:43 +0000 http://pattricejones.info/blog/archives/27#comment-83 Thank you so much for the shout out! You've really hit so many of the issues right on the head. Of course men suffer PTSD as well, and many feel they must be in complete denial of any emotions, that are as you put it feminine or that they perceive as weak. But it is acceptable sometimes for men to express more "masculine" emotions, especially if they somehow deny ownership of the emotion, ie "You make me so angry" or "you make me crazy." Naturally many men are learning how to avoid these pitfalls. Some have excellent examples at home, fathers that were emotionally available for example or raised them without stereotypes. Other men have had to overcome really bad examples as they try to find ways to be more whole human beings. I do think that many males were abused as children, because child abuse is so rampant in our culture, yet I think fewer men seek help to resolve trauma, which is unfortunate. Women too buy into these stereotypes as they try to lead, sadly. They may think that this is the only way they can be taken seriously. Sometimes women can be the hardest on other women, perhaps in some attempt to prove just how "strong" and unemotional they are. Thank you so much for the shout out!

You’ve really hit so many of the issues right on the head. Of course men suffer PTSD as well, and many feel they must be in complete denial of any emotions, that are as you put it feminine or that they perceive as weak. But it is acceptable sometimes for men to express more “masculine” emotions, especially if they somehow deny ownership of the emotion, ie “You make me so angry” or “you make me crazy.”

Naturally many men are learning how to avoid these pitfalls. Some have excellent examples at home, fathers that were emotionally available for example or raised them without stereotypes. Other men have had to overcome really bad examples as they try to find ways to be more whole human beings.

I do think that many males were abused as children, because child abuse is so rampant in our culture, yet I think fewer men seek help to resolve trauma, which is unfortunate.

Women too buy into these stereotypes as they try to lead, sadly. They may think that this is the only way they can be taken seriously. Sometimes women can be the hardest on other women, perhaps in some attempt to prove just how “strong” and unemotional they are.

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